Your car should also be outside of its warranty in order to keep from voiding a warranty on your car. This generally only affects a low percentage of vehicles that received . I got it too. 21N08 is for those with engine shudders. The vehicle is a CPO but I feel like the selling dealership didn't do a great job looking it over, so I took to a local dealer in AZ (I purchased it in UT). However, if the vibrations are severe enough to cause your car to shake or rattle, then its definitely time to take it to a mechanic for further diagnosis. develop an undesirable noise. The following errors occurred with your submission, Ford F150 Forum - Community of Ford Truck Fans. In simple terms, engine shudder is a vibration that can be felt coming from the engine bay. Ford is aware of this problem and has issued a recall to fix it. The engine shudders 21N08 issue is a problem that causes the engine to shake or shudder. Im going to try to use it as a point of negotiation. additional VCT or engine timing related components not included in the Parts List. By addressing the engine shudder 21N08 issue, the cars performance and fuel efficiency can be improved. t seems like every other Raptor and Ford 10R80 has these issues. Are CSP's only performed as needed? It may not display this or other websites correctly. Any shop with an IDS scan tool will be able to check your car for transmission codes. make a purchase, we may earn a small commission. cam phaser rattles. I scheduled the initial step of the Cam Phaser Reprogramming about three weeks ago. Hello mjpatera! In some cases, a little bit of harmless vibrations is perfectly normal and nothing to worry about. Can the engine shudder 21N08 issue be fixed without reprogramming the PCM? The reprogram will update the engine control module (ECM) with new calibration files that are optimized for use with low deposit engines. But, this process cant be run in an unauthorized way. If youre experiencing engine shudder in your Ford vehicle, please bring it to your nearest dealership or service center so we can take a look and get it fixed up for you as soon as possible. Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing LOL, Ford Raptor Exterior Modifications Forum [GEN 1]. Id like to know whats causing this as well. 5.7 Hemi Lifter Failure Symptoms Causes & Fixes, Lomax Tonneau Cover problems & troubleshooting, Truxedo Sentry CT Problems & Troubleshooting, UnderCover Armor Flex Problems & Troubleshooting, Retrax Bed Cover Problems & Troubleshooting, Peragon Bed Cover Problems & Troubleshooting. This PCM update is program 21B10. If your Ford Raptor is experiencing engine shudder, you may need to have the PCM reprogrammed. If you own one of these affected vehicles, you should take it to your local dealership as soon as possible to have the ECM reprogrammed. So far, these recalls have been effective at solving the problem and improving customer satisfaction. Hmm very interesting perhaps I should take it in and see if they will replace mine. While engine shudder can be alarming, its important to keep in mind that not all instances are created equal. Within a day or less, the cam phaser was rattling again and my engine was shuddering. (CSP 21N03 and 21N08), Aftermarket Products, Reviews & Installation, Suggestions, Comments & Questions about the Forum. Manage Preferences - Fords are equipped with an adaptive shift feature where the computer learns to adjust the shifting for a smoother ride based on the drivers habits. Had my cam phasers done back in July. Proper maintenance is essential to keep a cars engine and transmission running smoothly. Everything seems relatively fine since, no check engine lights. This is the PCM update to prevent cam phaser rattle and will erase your tune. Was it stalling or did the auto shutoff just turn it off for a few seconds? We are talking about millions of trucks and SUVs! Dealer called and said bill would be $1200. 1997 F150 stalls when defrost turned on full, Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information. Summary of Related Cam Phaser Rattle Recalls: How Much Does Cam Phaser Replacement Out Of Warranty Cost? LOL, Ford Raptor Exterior Modifications Forum [GEN 1]. Hey! This resolves the cam phaser noise on startup issue (you know, the annoying Ford cold start cam phaser rattle). Copyright 2022 by MechanicsPick.com! Surprised to not see a whole slew of threads or posts on 21N08. JavaScript is disabled. The below is copied and pasted from this thread: 21N08 PCM REPROGRAM DUE TO ENGINE SHUDDER update. Unfortunately, many users reported a return of the symptoms after the 21B10 reflash. A manufacturer customer satisfaction program is a voluntary initiative undertaken by a company to improve customer satisfaction. Engine. So i guess every 30k miles i am looking at $1200 bill..crazy this is not covered under warranty!!! This newer field service action 21N08 software update is designed to solve the motor shuddering problem caused by the 21B10 reflash. 21B10 will be the first thing a Ford dealer would do. The problem stems from the fact that these vehicles are equipped with an engine control module (ECM) that can fail due to a software error. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. By updating the software that controls the PCM, the PCM can better control the engine and transmission. Mine does this while at low rpms. The transmission is responsible for transmitting power from the engine to the wheels. If you own a Ford vehicle, theres a good chance that it has been recalled for a PCM reprogramming. The Program 21N08 PCM Reprogram is designed to address an engine shudder condition on certain vehicles. 2019 F150 Shudder/Vibration | Page 2 | F150 Ecoboost Forum It is important to address the engine shudder 21N08 issue to maintain the performance and safety of the vehicle. Hopefully, I'll be switching over from 11+ years of Land Cruiser and Jeep ownership. In addition, the ECM will receive an update that will improve transmission shift quality. . Only detectable at a crawl speed. This newer field service action 21N08 software update is designed to solve the motor shuddering problem caused by the 21B10 reflash. I called my dealership this morning and they said there was nothing to be done to the vehicle. I have a 2018, just got the same notice. How can I verify my PCM is extended to 70k? Customer Satisfaction Program 21B10 was an extended warranty coverage on engine cam phasers on vehicles that had received a PCM reflash prior to December 31, 2021. Shudder/Jerking Issue When Accelerating - Ford F150 Forum Since we know what these issues are, you are safe to buy one of these Ford models. Dealer will. When the computer is programmed, it will erase this programming andthe vehicle will have to relearn your driving habits. The 21B10 was designed to solve a cam phasers rattle by increasing oil flow to them, but a percentage of affected vehicles demonstrated the side effect of an engine shudder. That population essentially consists of vehicles that were poorly maintained or ran low on oil. The truck. By updating the software, the PCM can better control the engine and transmission, which can help to eliminate the engine shudder 21N08 issue. And if you do need to restart it, make sure youre in neutral or park before doing so. The shudder may be felt during light acceleration, at speeds between 30-40 mph, and can last for a couple of seconds. and 2018-2020 Navigator Vehicles Equipped with a 3.5L GTDI Engine PCM Reprogram Due to Engine Shudder ;In a very low . The initial cam phasers rattle would generally first appear on a cold start due to a lack of oil. By updating the software that controls the PCM, the PCM can better control the engine and transmission. These are technically not recalls but an extension of coverage if the customer has a concern and falls within the window of . Originally, I understood the engine shudder to be a miscommunication between the camshaft position sensor and the PCM. 21N08B 1.2 Hours When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. 5. I noticed mine is doing this as well. PCM Reprogram Due To Engine Shudder 21N08 - Tool Tally The three trucks I have looked at have had the 21N08 update, so my question is..If you were in my position, would you pull the . From what the rep told me 21B10 needed to be done before 21N08 even though I have a FSA for 21N08. JavaScript is disabled. Has anyone had FSA 21N08 reflash done yet? | Page 4 | Ford Expedition Forum If your engine does stall unexpectedly, try to pull over to a safe location before attempting to restart it. I had the first PCM recall done too, but have an engine shudder issue. Cam phaser rattle back and check engine light on. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. Program 21N08 Pcm Reprogram Due to Engine Shudder This can be caused by something as simple as a loose spark plug, or something more serious like an issue with the crankshaft or connecting rods. Now they say it needs another round of cam phasers. I had the original work done under warranty 54k . It was program #21N08 PCM Reprogram due to engine shudder. Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information, https://www.f150forum.com/f118/field6275/index152/. Took it to dealer said it was cam phaser issue again. (1). It may not display this or other websites correctly. Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code. It is not necessary to remove the two left valve cover camshaft sensors. This campaign is for vehicles that had 21B10 S2 performed and had an engine shudder afterward. I'm a long-time Ford and automotive enthusiast, and I've been writing about cars for over 10 years. I brought my 2019 F-150 3.5 EB in for the recall. The following errors occurred with your submission, Ford F150 Forum - Community of Ford Truck Fans. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Mine doesn't die like yours, but definitely a problem there. Please register or login to enable Dark Mode. If a car is not regularly maintained, it can lead to problems such as the engine shudder 21N08 issue. The 21N08 is a pcm reprogram due to engine shudder that reverts the programming back to the original programming prior to the 21B10 reflash. Cookie Policy - This program covers certain repairs that may be needed as a result of a software issue. I've seen some mention of a shifter cable clip that breaks or something. At the time of the PCM reprogramming, it may address the engine shudder 21N08 issue, as this issue is often caused by a problem with the PCM software. I had 21B03 and knock on wood I haven't had any negative side effects like I have read about These guys are simply trying to Band-Aid a crap design. This can be caused by a variety of factors, including a dirty or faulty mass air flow sensor. When there are problems with the transmission, it can cause the engine to shudder. . My name is Zachary Drumm! 21N08 update, So I do not know if should pull the trigger or not. JavaScript is disabled. Sep 13, 2021. Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -. Terms of Service - This issue can be uncomfortable and potentially dangerous for the driver and passengers, and it can also lead to reduced performance and fuel efficiency. Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -. were completed so that you will be covered by the Ford warranty of 70k miles regarding cam phasers/VCT systems. Has anyone else experienced this after having the PCM updated? There is a recall, Mine has the same issue with the shudder after that recall. 21n08 - PCM reprogram due to engine shudder. and if so an updated calibration will be applied. Yesterday drove the truck from NY to Maine and all through the traffic out of NY truck had a strong vibration right around 1000 rpm and would settle at a full stop. Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code. Contact Us - call your dealer and schedule an appointment. You literally just typed back exactly what I said. It is an essential part of a cars powertrain system and is responsible for managing the fuel delivery, ignition timing, and transmission shifts to ensure optimal performance and efficiency of the car. Ford TSB 21N08 2019 F-150 | CarComplaints.com